Post: God vs Science
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02-05-2013, 10:02 PM
#1
Some extremely basic terminology...
Theist: believes in a god(s).
Deist: believes in a god(s) that created the universe but subsequently abandoned it and/or believes that reason and observation of the natural world are sufficient to determine the existence of god(s).
Atheist: does not believe in a god(s).
Agnostic: does not claim to know if a god exists or believes that such knowledge cannot be known, depending on the definition. Typically when I personally use this label I'm referring to the former.
Gnostic: claims to know one way or the other if a god exists.
There are some more but that's the basics down. I'm an agnostic atheist. What are you and why?
Edit: Thanks to whichever mod/admin butchered the thread's title and poll. The poll now makes no sense whatsoever.
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08-07-2013, 07:25 AM
#309
08-09-2013, 03:57 AM
#310
UnwrittenFayt
Haxor!
If you believe that someone LITERALLY was resurrected on their own days after dying, then you are an idiot.
The bible is a collection of stories written by King James' hired "scholars" as a way to unite his country under a single religion, because it would guarantee him being leader.
And I don't need to provide any proof God doesn't exit, because nobody in the world can prove he does. Stephen Hawking said it best, "the Universe does not leave room for God, or a divine creator." It just is illogical and not feasible.
Not to mention the numerous articles of parents who have tried "faith healing" to cure their kid's diseases only to be held on MURDER charges because they did not seek medical help.
You have faith in something that cannot be proven, not even a bit and want answers to life's toughest questions. Why not be OK in knowing you don't know everything? Are you that insecure as a person?
The bible is a collection of stories written by King James' hired "scholars" as a way to unite his country under a single religion, because it would guarantee him being leader.
And I don't need to provide any proof God doesn't exit, because nobody in the world can prove he does. Stephen Hawking said it best, "the Universe does not leave room for God, or a divine creator." It just is illogical and not feasible.
Not to mention the numerous articles of parents who have tried "faith healing" to cure their kid's diseases only to be held on MURDER charges because they did not seek medical help.
You have faith in something that cannot be proven, not even a bit and want answers to life's toughest questions. Why not be OK in knowing you don't know everything? Are you that insecure as a person?
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08-13-2013, 07:58 PM
#312
dapreacher23
Climbing up the ladder
Originally posted by juddylovespizza
Science - I hate to generalize - never has had the sole aim of attempting to disprove the claims made by religions (again a rather large thing, with practically infinite belief systems). Lets make it clear that it is about learning about reality through evidence and observation. If the conclusion of whatever is being studied in a scientific study happens to contradict a religion, that is an indirect effect as there is no intent or a "go after" religion type attitude - and even if there ever is, the scientific method is based upon evidence and must more trustworthy than empty claims based upon nothing. I think that it's important to understand this as many theists believe that scientists of any field have a personal vendetta against them, which is just delusional and ignorant.
Now should I give you some examples of when (any) religion has been wrong and science right on a topic? I have a problem of what religion we are discussing, let's presume Christianity. So firstly humanities "creation", Christianity claims a God created humans as they are and all other animals, of course we now know we have evolved over millions of years. We accredit this theory to Darwin but it has become so sophisticated and full of evidence since, I find it difficult to picture any theist disputing this as they would literally have to change reality. There are many more points I could make on the Universe, creation in general and the amazing technical and health developments due to scientists. However...
...I think you will raise a point that this doesn't disprove a God's existence, you would be correct. However specific religions' ideal of a deity and it's credibility is seriously questionable and the many discrepancies formed due to scientific discoveries, help in attempting to disprove and highlight the absurdities of religion. This would make a God's existence less likely, but not impossible, the laws of logic would not allow anyone to asset that something, anything does not exist. You may have heard you cannot prove a negative (it's a logical fallacy known as an argument from ignorance), but as I say including the points I raised it does lower the probability of existence by a huge amount.
I haven't been here again in a while, so hi again guys. I will wait for your reply if I remember to come back and visi
Now should I give you some examples of when (any) religion has been wrong and science right on a topic? I have a problem of what religion we are discussing, let's presume Christianity. So firstly humanities "creation", Christianity claims a God created humans as they are and all other animals, of course we now know we have evolved over millions of years. We accredit this theory to Darwin but it has become so sophisticated and full of evidence since, I find it difficult to picture any theist disputing this as they would literally have to change reality. There are many more points I could make on the Universe, creation in general and the amazing technical and health developments due to scientists. However...
...I think you will raise a point that this doesn't disprove a God's existence, you would be correct. However specific religions' ideal of a deity and it's credibility is seriously questionable and the many discrepancies formed due to scientific discoveries, help in attempting to disprove and highlight the absurdities of religion. This would make a God's existence less likely, but not impossible, the laws of logic would not allow anyone to asset that something, anything does not exist. You may have heard you cannot prove a negative (it's a logical fallacy known as an argument from ignorance), but as I say including the points I raised it does lower the probability of existence by a huge amount.
I haven't been here again in a while, so hi again guys. I will wait for your reply if I remember to come back and visi
Actually darwins theory has been disproven. There were no transitional fossil that darwin said would be key to his theory. Also science can only examine what is actually here and not prove what came into existence therefore they couldnt prove how humanity came into existence but only speculate using only what they have around them, therefore science fails.
Lets look at this verse the Bible has proven yet science makes the claim they have known this a million years later....
Hebrews 11:3
By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.
The Bible makes the claim that creation is made up of invisible material, science was ignorant in this subject and we now know creation is made of an invisible matter called "Atoms" This verse is written of 2000 years ago.
Here is another simple verse
Leviticus 17:11
“For the life of the flesh is in the blood.”
This verse is written 3000 years ago and it says we need our blood to survive. Science up until 120 years ago believed sick people needed to be bled out.
Now the ball is in your court do you believe something that was agreed upon just 120 years ago or something that was proven over 3000 years ago.
08-14-2013, 02:56 PM
#313
dapreacher23
Climbing up the ladder
Originally posted by Satan
Did anyone say Darwin was true in all things? Science change as we get more info and getting smarter. And not ignorant as you are.
But if you want to live blind in a book do that, I believe in superman because the superman comic book says it.
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BTW DON'T TALK ABOUT SCIENCE, BECAUSE YOU'RE EXTREMELY IGNORANT, IT ONLY MAKES YOU LOOK STUPID...
jk you're stupid
INFRACTION ME FOR SAYING THE TRUTH COME ON!
But if you want to live blind in a book do that, I believe in superman because the superman comic book says it.
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BTW DON'T TALK ABOUT SCIENCE, BECAUSE YOU'RE EXTREMELY IGNORANT, IT ONLY MAKES YOU LOOK STUPID...
jk you're stupid
INFRACTION ME FOR SAYING THE TRUTH COME ON!
Exactly science has to change their beliefs when more information has been receive where the Bible has stayed consisted throughout the years. I have proven that the Bible is truth given just two verse that show the consistency of the Bible whereas science had to completely change their views. You want truth I have given it to you.
Oh btw stop spamming my rep because you disagree with the truth.
08-15-2013, 12:24 AM
#315
Budz
Former Staff
Originally posted by Satan
lmfao. You are so fucking ignorant that it is funny. Nah not really, it is sad that people still can be so stupid in 2013!
Btw truth? Because the bible says it? You are full of bullshit. Stay out of science, sub-human. My opinion about you, no offend.
Btw truth? Because the bible says it? You are full of bullshit. Stay out of science, sub-human. My opinion about you, no offend.
Satan, please stop harassing the guys on here. Be mature and don't use vulgar language towards other debaters.
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08-15-2013, 02:19 AM
#316
Number
Banned
Originally posted by Satan
There's no God, or anything supernatural.
Funny thing, in the past we worshiped the Sun, or the ocean or a volcano. Then one day some idiots came up with a God of all things you know. Religion is all fantasy and agnostic people should be atheist. Because If everyone believe in God, then it becomes normal to believe in God, and if you say you don't then the rage of the "normal" people will scare you with a lake of fire. ( Good way to use fear to get people to believe)
Also Stephen Hawking said , "the Universe does not leave room for God, or a divine creator." It just is illogical and not feasible.
And I know there is no God, because from what I said above when everyone believes in Bullshit it is normal + it is fantasy because we once also worshiped our Sun. There is no God, call me arrogant. You will probably say to me "Can you prove it?" that is a retarded question, because God doesn't exist, it would be the same if I said, can you prove that I have a blue dog that can go though walls and only I can see it and touch it, but no one else can.
I will say, religion is dieing in the West, which is good, but our next and biggest enemy is Islam.
If you disagree, then back off, I will never change my mind and I am right because call me arrogant.
Funny thing, in the past we worshiped the Sun, or the ocean or a volcano. Then one day some idiots came up with a God of all things you know. Religion is all fantasy and agnostic people should be atheist. Because If everyone believe in God, then it becomes normal to believe in God, and if you say you don't then the rage of the "normal" people will scare you with a lake of fire. ( Good way to use fear to get people to believe)
Also Stephen Hawking said , "the Universe does not leave room for God, or a divine creator." It just is illogical and not feasible.
And I know there is no God, because from what I said above when everyone believes in Bullshit it is normal + it is fantasy because we once also worshiped our Sun. There is no God, call me arrogant. You will probably say to me "Can you prove it?" that is a retarded question, because God doesn't exist, it would be the same if I said, can you prove that I have a blue dog that can go though walls and only I can see it and touch it, but no one else can.
I will say, religion is dieing in the West, which is good, but our next and biggest enemy is Islam.
If you disagree, then back off, I will never change my mind and I am right because call me arrogant.
Slow down there QB. Your claims are unsubstantiated and poorly purportedly justified. Your contention is that religion does not contain a shroud of truth and that absolute atheism should be perpetuated. Hitherto I have failed to see any citations or justification for these concepts or mere descriptions of your "utopian society". Moreover, quoting Stephen Hawking is an argument from authority, considering he is not a philosopher, he is a physicist / cosmologist so that citation is irrelevant.
As for your next volatile claim, religion is NOT dying in the west. The actual percentage of atheists in America is 1.6% (Citation: You must login or register to view this content.).
Your "argument" is predicated on personal prejudice and conjectures.
Albeit I'll play along we'll arrive at your final point of reasoning.
I can quite certainly rule out the existence of an invisible, blue dog that fly through walls because it does not satisfy the Evidence and Knowledge Expectation Criterion.
On the absence of evidence, we can deny the existence of something O only if we should expect to possess evidence sufficient to know that O exists but in fact lack it.
An atheist must say that
(a) the epistemological condition in which we lie pertaining to belief in the existence of a God meet the aforementioned Criteria; and
(b) demonstrate that humans lack sufficient evidence to prove that a God exist
We reject the flying blue dog (and Santa Clause, Leprechauns, etc) because we do have evidence for their absence (a lack of bones from dead ancestors, fecal matter, etc.)
We don't have evidence for God's absence as he might not show himself because people would develop morally significant freedom.
Atheists have high standards for this yet don't follow the premise when talking about objects in everyday life appearing out of nowhere with basic intuition.
An absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
I suggest you read up on Argumentation Theory before embarrassing yourself further.
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