(adsbygoogle = window.adsbygoogle || []).push({}); The thread that was the shining light of the last two debating sections(ugh, really?) that was God vs Fact has been trashed or something(ugh, again) so this thread is here to take the place of that one.

Some extremely basic terminology...

Theist: believes in a god(s).
Deist: believes in a god(s) that created the universe but subsequently abandoned it and/or believes that reason and observation of the natural world are sufficient to determine the existence of god(s).
Atheist: does not believe in a god(s).
Agnostic: does not claim to know if a god exists or believes that such knowledge cannot be known, depending on the definition. Typically when I personally use this label I'm referring to the former.
Gnostic: claims to know one way or the other if a god exists.

There are some more but that's the basics down. I'm an agnostic atheist. What are you and why?

Edit: Thanks to whichever mod/admin butchered the thread's title and poll. The poll now makes no sense whatsoever.

Okay, my opinion god and jesus are fake. And they both fuck with peoples minds. I never have seen them. Pics, real life. Or anything so thry never existed.

Are you kidding me, that is wrong in so many levels. Your beliefs ARE your reality. They construct the reality you live in. Saying the sun will expand is a belief an itself and thus its your reality.
Ask an african if the sun will expand and hell give u a different belief, thus he has a different reality.

Wether he is correct or not depends on each and everyones worldview, in this case this african is incorrect in YOUR terms.
All this is obviously an implication that reality is subjective and nothing is really true in the end.

Reality does not equal truth. Reality equals a sum of beliefs.

I leave 1 thing here.

How were the stars/universe created from nothing? To make it work properly I guess can't explain, god caused an explosion? Or just created the universe, I mean you can't create an explosion from absolutely nothing, not 1 particle was before the explosion.

Also, rule of alchemy, you must give something to create something. (I think)

I am a true believer in God. I am a Catholic. Do you think that the Big Bang just happened? Who made the Big Bang happen? Things like that don't just happen. There are too many of what you atheists call "coincidences" for God to be fake.

While this is for everyone I would love to see your response.

Going to leave this here, will be interested to see any responses that follow.

If the Judeo-Christian God (New Testament and Old Testament Christianity) does truly exist, then he is a sick twisted fuck and I wouldn't want to spend all of eternity with him anyway.

Starting off, here are some quotes from the bible taken from the New and Old Testament, which show how "God" feels towards women. There is really nothing to interpret here, this is no metaphor, but this is very straight forward.

Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law. (1 Corinthians 14:34)

And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church. (1 Corinthians 14:35)

“No wickedness comes anywhere near the wickedness of a woman…..Sin began with a woman and thanks to her we all must die” (Ecclesiasticus 25:19,24).

“A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I don’t permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner” (I Timothy 2:11-14).

“The birth of a daughter is a loss” (Ecclesiasticus 22:3).

“Keep a headstrong daughter under firm control, or she will abuse any indulgence she receives. Keep a strict watch on her shameless eye, do not be surprised if she disgraces you” (Ecclesiasticus 26:10-11).

“As in all the congregations of the saints, women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission as the law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church.” (I Corinthians 14:34-35)

“When a woman has her regular flow of blood, the impurity of her monthly period will last seven days, and anyone who touches her will be unclean till evening. Anything she lies on during her period will be unclean, and anything she sits on will be unclean. Whoever touches her bed must wash his clothes and bathe with water, and he will be unclean till evening. Whoever touches anything she sits on must wash his clothes and bathe with water, and he will be unclean till evening. Whether it is the bed or anything she was sitting on, when anyone touches it, he will be unclean till evening” (Lev. 15:19-23).

“If a man takes a wife and, after lying with her, dislikes her saying, ‘I married this woman, but when I approached her, I did not find proof of her virginity,’ …and no proof of the girl’s virginity can be found, she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of the town shall stone her to death. She has done a disgraceful thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house. You must purge the evil from among you.” (Deut 22:13-21)

“A bad wife brings humiliation, downcast looks, and a wounded heart. Slack of hand and weak of knee is the man whose wife fails to make him happy. Woman is the origin of sin, and it is through her that we all die. Do not leave a leaky cistern to drip or allow a bad wife to say what she likes. If she does not accept your control, divorce her and send her away” (Ecc 25:25).

“Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God…A man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man. For man did not come from woman, but woman from man; neither was man created for woman, but woman for man. For this reason, and because of the angels, the woman ought to have a sign of authority on her head” (I Corinthians 11:3-10).

“They called out to Lot and said, “Where are the men who came to you tonight? Send them out to us so we can have sex with them! Lot went out to them at the entrance and shut the door behind him. He said, “on’t do this evil, my brothers. Look, I’ve got two daughters who haven’t had sexual relations with a man. I’ll bring them out to you, and you can do whatever you want to them. However, don’t do anything to these men, because they have come under the protection of my roof.” (Genesis 19:5-8 )

“Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church. . . .” (Ephesians Chapter Five)

"In pain shall you bring forth children, woman, and you shall turn to your husband and he shall rule over you. And do you not know that you are Eve? God’s sentence hangs still over all your sex and His punishment weighs down upon you. You are the devil’s gateway; you are she who first violated the forbidden tree and broke the law of God. It was you who coaxed your way around him whom the devil had not the force to attack. With what ease you shattered that image of God: Man! Because of the death you merited, even the Son of God had to die. . . . Woman, you are the gate to hell” (Tertullian)

Here is how "God" feels about slavery, further showing why I wouldn't want to spend eternity with him if he exists.

The following passage describes the sickening practice of sex slavery.

When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)

It says you can beat both male and female slaves with a rod so hard that as long as they don't die right away you are cleared of any wrong doing.

When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)


There are a countless number of contradictions, however here are a few. I ask any Christians out there if the Bible was divinely inspired, then why would it have so many really obvious contradictions?

Theological doctrines:

1. God is satisfied with his works
Gen 1:31
God is dissatisfied with his works.
Gen 6:6

2. God dwells in chosen temples
2 Chron 7:12,16
God dwells not in temples
Acts 7:48

3. God dwells in light
Tim 6:16
God dwells in darkness
1 Kings 8:12/ Ps 18:11/ Ps 97:2

4. God is seen and heard
Ex 33:23/ Ex 33:11/ Gen 3:9,10/ Gen 32:30/ Is 6:1/
Ex 24:9-11
God is invisible and cannot be heard
John 1:18/ John 5:37/ Ex 33:20/ 1 Tim 6:16

5. God is tired and rests
Ex 31:17
God is never tired and never rests
Is 40:28

6. God is everywhere present, sees and knows all things
Prov 15:3/ Ps 139:7-10/ Job 34:22,21
God is not everywhere present, neither sees nor knows all
things
Gen 11:5/ Gen 18:20,21/ Gen 3:8

7. God knows the hearts of men
Acts 1:24/ Ps 139:2,3
God tries men to find out what is in their heart
Deut 13:3/ Deut 8:2/ Gen 22:12

8. God is all powerful
Jer 32:27/ Matt 19:26
God is not all powerful
Judg 1:19

9. God is unchangeable
James 1:17/ Mal 3:6/ Ezek 24:14/ Num 23:19
God is changeable
Gen 6:6/ Jonah 3:10/ 1 Sam 2:30,31/ 2


If god is all knowing and all powerful, why with a perfect God in control would 99% of all species which have ever existed are extinct?

Why are you so quick to dismiss the possible existence of all other Gods while you so strongly believe in yours? Have you seen evidence showing you your god is the one and if so, why have you not shared this evidence?

Faith is what religious people use to justify beliefs which have no reason, logic or evidence. If you had any evidence showing otherwise you wouldn't need faith.

Religion has clearly been a burden to society as a whole throughout history.

Just from the genocides alone over 700 million people have died, which is far more than any other cause of death besides natural causes.

Religion has held back scientific research many times such as Galileo, who was placed on house arrest for going against the beliefs of the church.

I am an Agnostic Athiest, I do not claim to know that a God or higher being does not exist, however I have never seen any evidence showing that him/her does so I choose not to believe. I am agnostic to God as I am agnostic to Santa Claus, I cannot prove God does not exist just as I cannot prove Santa Claus doesn't exist. I don't claim to know Santa doesn't exist, but I have never seen anything showing he does so why would I believe in him? That is basically my point of view on Religion.

1. Not 100% of everything if true maybe? Not sure how to explain
2. I'm sure those were for those times, as that was currently the law???

Ahhhhh here we go again. First of let me state that I am an atheist or humanist or anti-theist or whatever you see it as. First of all all those who say ohh the singularitys can explode by them selfs. WRONG. Learn some basic Chemistry and physics first then rethink your statements about that. Did you know that if dark matter and anti-matter come in contact they create a massive explosion? One that is large enough to start the Big Bang. Also there are countless types of matter that when they interact with each other and explode.

Second of all, all those that say " ohhh were did that singled cell bio organism come from? It's sooo fake m8 we came from a dust ball dat god made". No just NO. About 4 billion years ago when the earth was going though some chemical processes amino acids were formed which turned into proteins then into single cell bio organisms call prokaryote cells. These cells replicated via mitosis (asexual reproduction) and evolved to their habitats and due to natural selection where the the best one survives, we survived over the homogenesis species.

Furthermore, the utter spidity and how many contradictions there are in the bible the book that was written by people of god. Just look at grumpys list of contradictions above for a list. Also the messages that god and jesus give to people are stupid and just wrong. He promotes slavery: When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11) Quite honestly if that is what your god is teaching he should be banned from being preached and banned from existence as that is sickly.

If your old teatament is true, then god is the worst thing ever 'Invented' as the genocide in the bible is ridiculous. (Again grumpy also stated this). I understand that most people don't get a choice in their religion as their parents chose it for them and are really the ones to blame. I would like to see a fundamentalist cristian or any other religion that was religious by choice, I bet there's not many.

Did you know a survey in the US found that atheists and secular people are less nationalistic, prejudiced, antisemitic, racist, dogmatic, ethnocentric, closed-minded, and authoritarian. That's gotta be a bonus for atheism. Also most people who have committed major history changing crimes have done it in the name of religion. Hmmm something's wrong with you theists.

Ultimately atheists and atheism is a whole lot better than any religion. There are no stupid rules and laws that discriminate against people and their personality (I'm looking at you Catholic Church). JOIN THE ATHEISTS TODAY!.

You start out by telling me that I am wrong. Than tell me reality is subject to belief. Make up your mind. And why the fuck are you evening replying to me. I probably made this post like 1-2 years ago. Like damn dude, Fuck off.