Post: Americans and War
Options
12-01-2010, 08:38 PM
#1
iPython
Haxor!
I'm sure anyone with half a brain realizes that America is currently engaging in a war, they've been engaged in previous wars and will be engaged in wars to come. My question is, do you guys think the USA is the innocent one is these wars?
My opinion, hell no. The war against Afghanistan and the Taliban was caused by Americans, you can choose not to believe me but it is true. Take a class on world issues or do some research and you'll see why.
I hate to touch on such a sensitive subject, but I think 9/11 could have been avoided if Americans kept their nose out of business that isn't theirs.
I actually feel sorry for those who think that your soldiers are fighting for such a good cause (they are defending your country, yes, but think about why it needs to be defended in the first place), I respect any soldier greatly for what they are doing but some people are under the illusion that the USA is innocent when the war you are facing right now is your fault.
No American bashing intended, btw.
The following 5 users say thank you to iPython for this useful post:
12-14-2010, 01:30 PM
#65
xinfectedsoulx
Daddy's home.
Originally posted by needalifesoon
To claim that Britian did not NEED American involvement in the war is laughable.
Apparently brainwashing is not exclusive to this side of the Atlantic.
Without Roosevelt's lend lease program Britian and Russia would have struggled in their war efforts.
Britian had no military presence on continental Europe before US entry.
They had won the control of their airspace, were instrumental in controlling Atlantic shipping lanes, and pushed Axis forces out of North Africa.
Everything after that had full American involvement including all battles in Europe.
Total battle deaths against Germany are nearly the same for the US and Britian at about 350,000.
If the US had not declared war on Germany, after pearl harbor, Hitler would have been able to concentrate his forces on winning the eastern front.
Even if Russia had been sucessful, without 2 other fronts being opened, all of Western Europe would be speaking Russian now or German if they failed.
After 1940, Britian was never in a position to assault mainland Europe without help.
No one can question the bravery or importance of the British role in WW2, nor deny that Russia killed over 80% of the German military and suffered 40 times the causualties of the US and Britian combined.
But it is extremely unlikely that Germany would have been defeated without full American entry into the war.
America did not win the war and neither did Britian.
It was a combined effort, with Russia contributing the most.
American and British contributions were nearly equal, other than Britian standing alone for a critical 2 year period.
Thank god Chamberlin was replaced by Churchill or the world might look very different today, but only someone completely ignorant of history should believe that it would not look different today without full American involvement in the European theater.
Apparently brainwashing is not exclusive to this side of the Atlantic.
Without Roosevelt's lend lease program Britian and Russia would have struggled in their war efforts.
Britian had no military presence on continental Europe before US entry.
They had won the control of their airspace, were instrumental in controlling Atlantic shipping lanes, and pushed Axis forces out of North Africa.
Everything after that had full American involvement including all battles in Europe.
Total battle deaths against Germany are nearly the same for the US and Britian at about 350,000.
If the US had not declared war on Germany, after pearl harbor, Hitler would have been able to concentrate his forces on winning the eastern front.
Even if Russia had been sucessful, without 2 other fronts being opened, all of Western Europe would be speaking Russian now or German if they failed.
After 1940, Britian was never in a position to assault mainland Europe without help.
No one can question the bravery or importance of the British role in WW2, nor deny that Russia killed over 80% of the German military and suffered 40 times the causualties of the US and Britian combined.
But it is extremely unlikely that Germany would have been defeated without full American entry into the war.
America did not win the war and neither did Britian.
It was a combined effort, with Russia contributing the most.
American and British contributions were nearly equal, other than Britian standing alone for a critical 2 year period.
Thank god Chamberlin was replaced by Churchill or the world might look very different today, but only someone completely ignorant of history should believe that it would not look different today without full American involvement in the European theater.
Sorry but you came late to the party. I can't be arsed with this thread any more. No matter what I say someone always comes in a repeats something already said, so I find I repeat myself more times. I haven't read your post, and I'm not going to, not to be arrogant, it's just that I really, really can't be arsed. No matter what I say or anybody else says, the Americans will still think all high and mighty of themselves and their country.
12-14-2010, 10:36 PM
#66
NeedaLifeSoon
Retired Life
12-16-2010, 04:25 PM
#67
G-Hutch
I am error
I know you say that the UK was screwed in WWII without the U.S.A who saved them with typical 'dramatic' (Late) timing. Actually Britain has just single-handedly prevented an Invasion of the UK (operation Sea Lion I think) by the Germans because of the skill, bravery and determination of the U.K.
Before you quote me and put words in my mouth:
1. I never said that Britain could win the war on their own, I am just saying that we managed to push back the invasion date. Once again, being separated off from the rest of Europe gives us a massive defensive advantage.
2. I'm not saying that Britain could then construct their own landings. We lacked the raw materials and men to do so. I would like to point out that D-day was almost entirely British planning. Mulburay (spelt wrong I think) Harbours, the beach splits, Duplex Drive tanks, Oh and I believe on D-Day the American beaches still had British troops on, pulling of key roles.
Also I'd like to say the USA's help in WWI is completely Negligible.
Before you quote me and put words in my mouth:
1. I never said that Britain could win the war on their own, I am just saying that we managed to push back the invasion date. Once again, being separated off from the rest of Europe gives us a massive defensive advantage.
2. I'm not saying that Britain could then construct their own landings. We lacked the raw materials and men to do so. I would like to point out that D-day was almost entirely British planning. Mulburay (spelt wrong I think) Harbours, the beach splits, Duplex Drive tanks, Oh and I believe on D-Day the American beaches still had British troops on, pulling of key roles.
Also I'd like to say the USA's help in WWI is completely Negligible.
12-17-2010, 12:13 AM
#68
NeedaLifeSoon
Retired Life
Originally posted by Hutch
I know you say that the UK was screwed in WWII without the U.S.A who saved them with typical 'dramatic' (Late) timing. Actually Britain has just single-handedly prevented an Invasion of the UK (operation Sea Lion I think) by the Germans because of the skill, bravery and determination of the U.K.
Before you quote me and put words in my mouth:
1. I never said that Britain could win the war on their own, I am just saying that we managed to push back the invasion date. Once again, being separated off from the rest of Europe gives us a massive defensive advantage.
2. I'm not saying that Britain could then construct their own landings. We lacked the raw materials and men to do so. I would like to point out that D-day was almost entirely British planning. Mulburay (spelt wrong I think) Harbours, the beach splits, Duplex Drive tanks, Oh and I believe on D-Day the American beaches still had British troops on, pulling of key roles.
Also I'd like to say the USA's help in WWI is completely Negligible.
Before you quote me and put words in my mouth:
1. I never said that Britain could win the war on their own, I am just saying that we managed to push back the invasion date. Once again, being separated off from the rest of Europe gives us a massive defensive advantage.
2. I'm not saying that Britain could then construct their own landings. We lacked the raw materials and men to do so. I would like to point out that D-day was almost entirely British planning. Mulburay (spelt wrong I think) Harbours, the beach splits, Duplex Drive tanks, Oh and I believe on D-Day the American beaches still had British troops on, pulling of key roles.
Also I'd like to say the USA's help in WWI is completely Negligible.
Please go online and read British publications concerning operation Sealion.
It was the German plan for the invasion of England.
It was never implemented and even Hitler realized its futility and canceled it completley in early 41.
They had lost air superiority and had no naval land assault capibility.
There was never a land assault against England ( as you have earlier claimed ) except a small, repulsed attempt, on the channel islands.
In the 3 year period before US entry, British forces had been defeated and removed from mainland Europe.
They struggled in North Africa and may have lost that battle if Rommel had not be relieved and recalled to Germany, before being sent back after it was too late to change the outcome.
D-Day invasion planning had been going on for some time, but do not believe there was no US planning nor who was the overall commander of the landings or the remainder of the war's prosecution.
What idiot believes there were not British forces involved in the landings, as there were Canandian and Australian.
Please explain why, if we came in so late, that US forces had as many casualties as British forces in Western Europe, when you were fighting 3 years longer than us?
I do not claim America won the war, please do not descredit American lives lost and its contribution to the Western Allies efforts to defeat Germany in WW2.
As for WW1, if we had refused any involvement at all,
there would likely have been no 2nd war.
The way France and England handled post war Europe( and the US bank collapse in 29) is what led to the rise of the Nazi party.
Go online ( there is historical text from every nation ) and educate yourself on both wars before you make ridiculas claims about American involvment in Europe in the last hundred years.
Only the ignorant on this side of the Atlantic question British motives or bravery but I will defend our bravery and desire to defend our allies at their time of need.
Even when their Ignorant resent it...
12-17-2010, 12:27 AM
#69
G-Hutch
I am error
Originally posted by needalifesoon
Please go online and read British publications concerning operation Sealion.
It was the German plan for the invasion of England.
It was never implemented and even Hitler realized its futility and canceled it completley in early 41.
They had lost air superiority and had no naval land assault capibility.
There was never a land assault against England ( as you have earlier claimed ) except a small, repulsed attempt, on the channel islands.
In the 3 year period before US entry, British forces had been defeated and removed from mainland Europe.
They struggled in North Africa and may have lost that battle if Rommel had not be relieved and recalled to Germany, before being sent back after it was too late to change the outcome.
D-Day invasion planning had been going on for some time, but do not believe there was no US planning nor who was the overall commander of the landings or the remainder of the war's prosecution.
What idiot believes there were not British forces involved in the landings, as there were Canandian and Australian.
Please explain why, if we came in so late, that US forces had as many casualties as British forces in Western Europe, when you were fighting 3 years longer than us?
I do not claim America won the war, please do not descredit American lives lost and its contribution to the Western Allies efforts to defeat Germany in WW2.
As for WW1, if we had refused any involvement at all,
there would likely have been no 2nd war.
The way France and England handled post war Europe( and the US bank collapse in 29) is what led to the rise of the Nazi party.
Go online ( there is historical text from every nation ) and educate yourself on both wars before you make ridiculas claims about American involvment in Europe in the last hundred years.
Only the ignorant on this side of the Atlantic question British motives or bravery but I will defend our bravery and desire to defend our allies at their time of need.
Even when their Ignorant resent it...
It was the German plan for the invasion of England.
It was never implemented and even Hitler realized its futility and canceled it completley in early 41.
They had lost air superiority and had no naval land assault capibility.
There was never a land assault against England ( as you have earlier claimed ) except a small, repulsed attempt, on the channel islands.
In the 3 year period before US entry, British forces had been defeated and removed from mainland Europe.
They struggled in North Africa and may have lost that battle if Rommel had not be relieved and recalled to Germany, before being sent back after it was too late to change the outcome.
D-Day invasion planning had been going on for some time, but do not believe there was no US planning nor who was the overall commander of the landings or the remainder of the war's prosecution.
What idiot believes there were not British forces involved in the landings, as there were Canandian and Australian.
Please explain why, if we came in so late, that US forces had as many casualties as British forces in Western Europe, when you were fighting 3 years longer than us?
I do not claim America won the war, please do not descredit American lives lost and its contribution to the Western Allies efforts to defeat Germany in WW2.
As for WW1, if we had refused any involvement at all,
there would likely have been no 2nd war.
The way France and England handled post war Europe( and the US bank collapse in 29) is what led to the rise of the Nazi party.
Go online ( there is historical text from every nation ) and educate yourself on both wars before you make ridiculas claims about American involvment in Europe in the last hundred years.
Only the ignorant on this side of the Atlantic question British motives or bravery but I will defend our bravery and desire to defend our allies at their time of need.
Even when their Ignorant resent it...
For the record, I never mention operation Sealion was implemented. I said they prevented the invasion. Which they did mainly through the Battle of Britain. Just because I said they prevented it, doesn't mean the Germans turned up at the beaches. Never for one moment did I claim that there was in fact a land assault. I said there was plans.
You wont believe some of the people who argue towards D-day being a solely American affair. Before I continue I would like to say I am not saying that the USA did nothing in WWII. I know that they played a major role and without them things would be different today. I was merely putting forward a few points which, some ignorant Americans (Yes there's Ignorant Brit's as well, lots of them) may possibly overlook (I am not calling you ignorant or calling every American Ignorant)
I've got to pick you up on the second world war thing though. The USA was at the treaty of Versailles and Implicated the League of Nations. After creating it, they promptly left the league to fail as America decided to stop being involved in Europe. The failure of the League (along with the appeasement policy -> not the US's fault) Caused Hitler the grow in confidence and break the conditions of the treaty of Versailles.
I would like to end by saying:
I do not discredit American Bravery in the Second World War. They did a fantastic Job and by posting in this thread I was aiming for a slightly more neutral viewpoint. I just wished to push forward a couple of things, that often get forgotten in the heat of an argument. Some of my points are not directed towards you and competent Americans. I am aiming them at the minority, to just try and force some kind of balanced argument into their heads.
Copyright © 2026, NextGenUpdate.
All Rights Reserved.
