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For whoever may be interested in a run with no wheels...

I got a bid day planned tomorrow.

1) work on project "Myth Killer" a bit. Yeah its gonna be a good one.

2) work on the C7 GT6 edition, knuckle down n get a set up finished.

3) Do some comparison test. I got to do some side by sides to help a bud, I'm not finding a difference yet, but sometimes that just means you got to look a bit harder.

Ohhh I had me a fine day... Put a few hours in on some Myth Busting, that went well. Ohh do I have treat in store for the masses

Here is a sample of the days session with some MoTeC for a lap. My project is gonna be BIG but I still have to be patient as I have to collect some data off others and have to wait on them...




I didnt get any time in on the C7 but Ill try to make some time for it tomorrow.

Interesting video, You are surprisingly early on the throttle. You must have a strong confidence of the car and feeling that You can steer the car to the exit point of the corner. There comes my question about that to You and Odefinn:

What is Your approach if the rear end of the car feels ok but there is understeering on the front?
I like that car turn well and after apex I can let ( steer ) the car go to exit point. I think I know the variables what make the front end better but I don't know the best order or combination to use those variables.

When I ty to improve front end I surf between lsd accel, front toe, front spring, front camber and arb. Not very professional, I think I can improve this more systematic

Jounijkk

Thanks

In this case on a FWD front engine car I want to have as much grip on my front as I can, so the front roll bar is as light as possible (gone if in real world). This keeps my inside front weighted so I can put more power through it without the light inside bleeding off power. Remember springs will tend to push the tire into the track while roll bars will make the inside tire light.... A heavier inside tire lets me push the throttle hard with confidence I wont burn up the inside tire.

An issue Im noticing with many FF tunes is they have too much front roll bar setting. In the Real World racing FF one of the first things to do is pull out whatever factory roll bar is there up front, and use a really stiff roll bar in the rear. Attacking the weight from the opposite side stiff rear soft front, this keeps our grip on the front tires so they can steer and accelerate the car out of the corners.

If I were to go at the weight with more resistance for more weight the front bars would be stiffer than the rear, in a FF car this generates understweer. Hot lapping in TT this is not a big deal because the driver can give more steering angle to overcome the understeer, Racing with tire wear it becomes a different story. The excessive understeer and use of steering angle to overcome it eats the front tires tremendously and further worsen the issue. The car understeers more every corner and just keeps getting worse and worse each lap.

I wanted to show the MoTeC data for the steering wheel. the in game visual stops at 90deg and I wanted to show how the car is NOT understeering but tracking very very neutral. I will be doing another video of a competing tune done in a different style where its evident the car is understeering as sooooo much more steering angle is required to get through the corners... With tire wear it only takes 3 laps to fall on its face, the front end under steering more and more with every corner, the front tire shredding more and more rubber.

I don't like the feeling of a car just understeering all over the place either, it just sucks. If I thought car in GT6 were supposed to be driving like that I would think the physics are garbage, but thankfully when the car is tuned right it doesn't understeer like a School Bus and the car is enjoyable to trash around the corners.....

Also rear camber is helpful as it delays rear grip. Basically the car has a small patch going straight, but as the car is tossed into a corner and the weight shifts rolling the rear into the camber angle grabbing. This let's the driver toss the car hard into the corners with tail swinging out then easy to catch. Not as much camber up front as the front are steering and accelerating, I want to keep inside tire grip, too much camber will just start trading grip from the inside to the outside, not enough tho and she understeers mid corner. Neg front toe helps keep turn in sharp with the bit of neg camber for mid corner slowing turn in.

@Jounijkk, that car (CRX) is not optimal for really good driver, more likely its forgiving tune for beginners, can be driven fast, but suspension is bit too soft. Without any bigger changes you could play with springs +/-0.02 range, maybe 0.01 to front more and it helps bit for that understeer. Bodyroll is more or less minimised in cost of suspension stiffness, it won't jump when driving over curbs and maintains stability even cutting over them.
Optimal racing tune would have better traction and turnability but cost of bouncing easily from curbs could become problem. I tried to fix packet what just keeps you going without constant fear of hitting something else than track. That 0.01 more on front keeps this balance, didn't publish with it to keep car bit easier, that FITT compo tune is going to be tested with several style of driving, from wheel, ds3 stick and even ds3 buttons driving, easy will be good there.

But you could modify that CRX tune to suit your needs, it's kinda easy base to start tightening up to race condition.

If the secrete CSLARC thinks she knows about GT6 is that Restoring Rigidity acts like an improved rigidity installed, she is wrong.... Yeah fixing the engine puts on an oil change but it says it will in the description its no secrete..

CSLARC knows secretes about this game??? BULLSHIT!!!!

Very interesting and colourful discussion. Subject is pretty clear, but some of the expressions are enjoyable and good way to learn English. Don't give minors permanent mental problems.

Is jp talking about for ex spoon Honda Civic or Focus RS? With those cars there is odd weight transfer from rear to front which is is causing rear end sliding ( at least my horrible setup if I remember correct ). I wouldn't call it oversteering, it's more like unwanted and uncontrollable weight transfer, nothing to do with real life. It's easy to confuse to oversteering.

I watched the video again and focussed to the steering wheel. Yes, the car feels extremely neutral, You have eliminate understeering very effective. When the car is ready, please put the setup on Your pages.

I noticed You don't use left food braking ( throttle on and breaking at the same time, is it tail breaking in English? ). It's a must in rally, specially when driving ff car. Some drivers are using it also on the track, but more common way is using throttle to transfer weight and get more grip ( like You did in this video ). I have found this left food breaking useful also in gt6 to control weight transfer. I'm sure You know this very well, but You haven't found this useful on track?

Jounijkk

Dont mind the GTP beef, its a bit of an ongoing thing for a few of them to come here to Troll me ever since I stopped going to GTP...

Some of them at GTP (thousands of great members) realize that this thread has info they cant find at GTP, a perspective thats not drowned out with the GTP Trolls pissing all over the boards, but when they come here and the GTP Trolls notice the GTP Trolls don't like it and kick up the Trolling activity on NGU lol



Its interesting as this is a issue with cars running low rear camber and too much sway bar up front. The driver gives more steering angle to overcome understeer but ends up unsettling the rear kicking it out unexpectedly and suddenly without much warning, the solution to one issue causes a secondary issue, they just keep lapping until they pull off a clean quick lap.... There will be a set up I use to demonstrate the difference from Glitch Tuning to Real World Tuning and conveniently enough that car suffers from this exact issue... Also I show how the cars need for increased steering angle to overcome understeer (that will cause sudden loss of the rear in certain conditions) becomes less of an issue with Tire Wear turn on because the need to give more steering angle quickly eats up the front tires and they are less and less likely to grab and snap the rear, however the car understeers more and more with every corner. Glitch Tuners use that type of set up in TT with tire wear turned off, good for a hot lap but not racing...



We use the term "Trail Braking" for braking while turning into the corner vs early braking trying to get all the braking done before turning in.

Left foot braking is a mixed term.

It can mean simply using the right foot for throttle and the left foot for the brake over using the right foot for both. Automatics its common or clutch pedal less set ups.

It also can be used for applying brake while still being on the throttle, basically using both pedals at the same time.

FWD cars in Rally use this as a sort of e-brake snap turn, snapping the brakes while still on the throttle can somewhat lock the rear end using the throttle to keep the front from locking the rear snaps around, RWD or AWD can do the same shit just stabbing the throttle hard when the FWD doing so would generate understeer.

It is also used to control weight transfer to keep from snapping around from lift off oversteer, or even to keep from sliding off the track when understeering.



Your observation is spot on, I use the throttle to catch and steer out of the corners, mainly my set up is very much geared for this and conserving tires, however its also very much dependent on the track. The same set up on one track may not call for any left foot braking, while another may need it for a certain corner despite my set up. Some corners have character. It is interesting some are adopting the technique more into circuit racing, I would assume they are setting up the cars around the technique much like I have my car set up for my driving style of tossing the car into the corner and catching it with the throttle to throttle and steer my way out.

Cheers Bro.